108 amateur build project. What Have I done?

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orange4sky
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Joined: Fri May 26, 2017 6:34 pm

108 amateur build project. What Have I done?

Post by orange4sky » Wed Oct 18, 2017 7:25 pm

Hello again.

It's official. I'm now the proud owner of some gray tubing, two red wings and several boxes of parts. There's a Stinson 108 in there somewhere. Bob just delivered the 108 that was grandfathered in the amateur build category. I now have to do an inventory, see what parts I need and start ordering. I will need an engine as well. Since my ultimate plan is to put this on floats, Bob suggested an early O-540 235hp unit. Light, under-stressed and powerful. I hope I can find a used, running unit to try to keep the budget from hypoxia inducing altitudes. Any leads would be appreciated.

I have spoken with the MDRA people and have permission to rename it. It was originally called the McBride Voyageur, named after it's previous owners and showing some Canadian influence. They would like me to name it after myself so it would become the Sabathil Voyageur. I'm thinking about it but have not decided. The Czech version of my name would be Zavadil. The Zavadil Voyageur. I like that too. Could incorporate the Stinson lightning bolt into that.

The fuselage has already been cleaned, repaired and painted, so at least I have a head start. I'm going to a fabric covering workshop this coming weekend in Seattle to get up to speed on that part of the job. I'm going to be doing this full time until it flies so my goal is to have it flying on wheels by May. I'm a wood worker and fabricator so I'm not really an amateur in that sense and I have done all my own mechanical repairs and maintenance and some car and motorcycle restorations. Hopefully, I'm not totally off base in my goal.

I have been lurking here for a while and I'm looking forward to starting work and getting to know you folks.

Cheers,
Marcus.

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maxchord
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Re: 108 amateur build project. What Have I done?

Post by maxchord » Sun Oct 29, 2017 2:00 pm

That should keep you busy for a couple of weeks...
Al Corden
N97555 - Sid
1946 108

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moffetb
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Re: 108 amateur build project. What Have I done?

Post by moffetb » Mon Oct 30, 2017 1:14 am

Hopefully less time than my 1966 Sprite. (Now going on 14 years...)

Look forward to progress reports.

Brian
1946 Stinson 108-1, Franklin 165, at one time NX8306K

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Will.Ware
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Re: 108 amateur build project. What Have I done?

Post by Will.Ware » Wed May 09, 2018 3:13 am

Update? How’s it going?
Will Ware
Rockwall Texas 1F7
N97954 108-1
Follow my restoration blog at https://www.N97954.org

orange4sky
Posts: 46
Joined: Fri May 26, 2017 6:34 pm

Re: 108 amateur build project. What Have I done?

Post by orange4sky » Fri Mar 22, 2019 6:48 am

Update:

Lots done, lots to do.

Lots of paint stripping and bead blasting done. Lots of parts searching and ordering done. Lots of chin scratching done. Lots of tools bought. Lots of questions answered and more unanswered. Lots of lists made. Lots of nuts and bolts ordered. A few check boxes checked. Lots of instruments repainted. Lots of ebaying done. Tools. Did i mention the tools? I love me some tools.

I stripped and cleaned the wings and tail feathers.
Turned a new flap button out of ebony.
Fabricated an h-stab doubler.
Fabricated a strut cover from 2024-T3. Need the dome caps.
Re-keyed the Bendix mag switch.
Built the floorboards. Still need to apply finishes to them.
Glass beaded and fixed the seats frames and modified/extended the seat travel .
Cut out new boot cowl sides and cleco-ed them to the plane. Still have to run them through the english wheel to get them to fit.
Stripped and reshaped the windshield extrusion.
Made new wing root/vent blocks.
Made a new wood windshield top edge mount strip.
Repaired the passenger door sill.
Removed all of the steel brackets from the wings and glass beaded them.
Removed the tips in prep for the full width droop tips.
Replaced control surface bearings.
Fabricated new titanium lower door hinges. (because it was there)
Reshaped nose bowl. Need to weld and repair.


Things I still need to make and do:
Engine cowl.
Engine mount.
Seat covers.
Headliner.
New gear leg fairings.
New strut fairings.
Paint all of the steel bits.
Make new yoke shafts.


Things I still need:
Windshields
Fabric and Paint.
Wire.
Starter solenoid
Voltage regulator.
Engine and accessories. Lyc O-540 or Conti IO-360
Air screw.
Scott tailwheel.
ELT.
Antennas and cables.
Dual brake pedals.
Door latches.
Unknown parts.
Unknown Unknown parts.
Patience.
Money.
Luck...
2425 Floats... Please universe?

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Bob Picard
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Re: 108 amateur build project. What Have I done?

Post by Bob Picard » Sat Mar 23, 2019 9:04 pm

Marcus,
Great looking work on a great project. If you are looking for an engine, a Lycoming O-540B would be just the ticket for your project. It puts out an honest 235HP and uses unleaded mogas which is real handy in a floatplane because you can pull up to almost any marina fuel dock and fill up. It is bulletproof reliable and has great parts and expertise availability. I know of one Stinson that has that engine installation in it. It came out of a Cherokee 235 and has a fixed pitch prop. The problem is that there are not a whole lot O-540Bs out there. They were originally on the Apache 235 and, as mentioned the Cherokee 235, and perhaps the early Pawnee and a few other obscure airplanes. The good news is that somewhere in my search for something completely unrelated, I ran across something that mentioned a service bulletin or letter of some kind from Lycoming mentioning the conversion of an O-540A to an O540B, the major difference being the pistons reducing the compression ratio in order to burn 80 octane. The better news is that Lycoming made a shitload of these engines for Aztecs, Commanches, Aero Commander, etc., and are a lot easier to find. I have an O-540A in my Stinson floatplane,but unfortunately my Peterson autogas STC requires 91 octane non-ethanol auto gas which is not readily available at marinas. If you do decide on a O-540 and want an engine mount for it I can recommend EAMF in Chehalis Washington. They make a lot of mounts for the RV series homebuilts and have a fixture using a Stinson fuselage to make Lycoming mounts. They made me a new mount last year and everything fit perfectly.
Bob Picard
N6346M Stinson 108-3 Floats/Skis/Wheels
N48923 Taylorcraft L-2B skis/Wheels
Anchor Point, Alaska

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Will.Ware
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Re: 108 amateur build project. What Have I done?

Post by Will.Ware » Fri Mar 29, 2019 9:38 pm

What is this?Image


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Will Ware
Rockwall Texas 1F7
N97954 108-1
Follow my restoration blog at https://www.N97954.org

orange4sky
Posts: 46
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Re: 108 amateur build project. What Have I done?

Post by orange4sky » Sat Mar 30, 2019 12:52 am

Control surface bearing replacement. No more felt washers. It's installed with bearing retaining compound. One of the joys of the Amateur Build Category (Experimental).

That's the inboard aileron bearing, BTW.
Last edited by orange4sky on Sat Mar 30, 2019 1:18 am, edited 1 time in total.

orange4sky
Posts: 46
Joined: Fri May 26, 2017 6:34 pm

Re: 108 amateur build project. What Have I done?

Post by orange4sky » Sat Mar 30, 2019 1:15 am

Bob Picard wrote:
Sat Mar 23, 2019 9:04 pm
Marcus,
Great looking work on a great project. If you are looking for an engine, a Lycoming O-540B would be just the ticket for your project... If you do decide on a O-540 and want an engine mount for it I can recommend EAMF in Chehalis Washington. They make a lot of mounts for the RV series homebuilts and have a fixture using a Stinson fuselage to make Lycoming mounts. They made me a new mount last year and everything fit perfectly.
Thanks! That's great information. I was wondering who I could find to make me an engine mount and they are relatively close to me. I have been debating between an O-540 and a Continental IO-360. There's an IO-360 conversion near me and that plane is amazing.

My pro-con list is pretty tough.

They are both pretty pricey. I think the 540 is a bit more $$$ up front because it seems to be the holy grail for the kit plane people, the 30" tundra set, and everyone else.
360 has a lower GPH. (Someone on Hanger9 claims 8 gph cruise. 540 seems to burn 10-11.)
360 is lighter.
360 is a more complicated install.
540 can run on mogas.
540 is under stressed and probably more reliable.

I'm almost at the point where the first good deal of either that shows up I'll take it.

Someone on the yahoo list said they had an O-540 from an Aztec that they would part with but I can't remember who now.

Cheers,
Marcus.

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Will.Ware
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Re: 108 amateur build project. What Have I done?

Post by Will.Ware » Sat Mar 30, 2019 2:44 pm

How do you get into amateur built Exp category?


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Will Ware
Rockwall Texas 1F7
N97954 108-1
Follow my restoration blog at https://www.N97954.org

orange4sky
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Re: 108 amateur build project. What Have I done?

Post by orange4sky » Sun Mar 31, 2019 12:54 am

In Canada you need to demonstrate that 51% of your plane is owner built. I've heard it's not very common anymore for a previously certified aircraft to be allowed in the amateur built category but mine was started before they made it harder to get. IDK what the procedure is in the US.

orange4sky
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Joined: Fri May 26, 2017 6:34 pm

Prep and primer and alignment bummer.

Post by orange4sky » Mon Apr 01, 2019 2:44 am

Finally got to prepping and priming all of these little bits. I'm using zinc phosphate metal prep on all my steel followed by zinc phosphate or 2K epoxy primer. I'm using Moeller zinc phosphate primer for these little bits which is fantastic. It cures slowly but once cured seems bulletproof.

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And now, the bummer. This is how my brakes align with my wheel fairings. The fairings and brakes are from a different plane. I'm guessing The early Stinson's hubs were drilled differently.

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This is how they should be, I think. I need a blank bracket so I can align them Otherwise I will have to cut up my wheel fairings which I'd like to avoid. Am I getting something wrong here?

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Edit: I just re-found the Hangar9 post on this subject. So I'll try to get them to look more like this:

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orange4sky
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Re: 108 amateur build project. What Have I done?

Post by orange4sky » Wed May 01, 2019 11:08 pm

Exciting news! It looks like I have found my Engine. I was wondering if I ever would find a reasonable used engine. It's an O-540-B4B5 runner. 491 hours TSMO (OH in 2008) removed in excellent condition from a Cherokee 250 after the AME discovered it was not correct for the type. Comes with the matching Harzell CS prop, governor and spinner which was overhauled at the same time as the engine. Deal also the includes the carb, intake, Bendix mags, and a vacuum pump.

I have already found a lightweight starter for it and now I'm looking for an alternator. As experimental, I can opt for a Nippon Denso unit with a built in regulator that's the same unit that Plane Power uses. If you look on the back of one, the ND is embossed into the regulator cover. Just have to choose between 40 or 60 amps. My pitot heater draws 23A from cold, then drops to approx. 18A which makes me think that a 60A might be a good idea except that's a lot of weight to carry around for a rarely used, if critical, piece of equipment. Opinions?

Shopping for an engine mount, exhaust and oil cooler now.

Cheers,
Marcus.

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Bob Picard
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Re: 108 amateur build project. What Have I done?

Post by Bob Picard » Mon May 06, 2019 8:21 pm

EAMF in Chehalis, Washington will make you a mount. They made me a new mount for my O-540 and everything fit perfectly. They have a jig for a Stinson firewall and a core O-540 just to make sure everything fits. They are a family business, VERY nice people, and Stinson owners. Call Steve at (360)245-3478.
Bob Picard
N6346M Stinson 108-3 Floats/Skis/Wheels
N48923 Taylorcraft L-2B skis/Wheels
Anchor Point, Alaska

orange4sky
Posts: 46
Joined: Fri May 26, 2017 6:34 pm

Re: 108 amateur build project. What Have I done?

Post by orange4sky » Tue May 07, 2019 6:40 pm

How did you get that mount certified? I'm experimental but I have a certified friend who also wants to install an O-540.

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